Re: Streets of Rage 4

Security Fri May 01, 2020 9:07 pm

Jericho_mpm wrote:
I made a review myself this morning on you tube and i cussed the game so hard https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trlrngyNwOo&t=315s

Thumbs up! You got that right Like a Star @ heaven

Xillatem Sat May 02, 2020 6:04 am

Incase you were wondering if I bought the Limited Run SoR4 Limited Edition.

Yes, yes I did.

Oh and my opinions - It's mostly a v good game, but I hate how there's no "Classic Mode" (Arcade Mode with limited continues) plus I hate how the bosses act like they belong in Final Fight and don't mostly adher to the same rules as the player like in SoR2 (and BK3 for the most part).

thenomad Sat May 02, 2020 3:08 pm

Finished the game. It's definitely not good. Never the enemies were so annoying in SoR games like in this one. Cheap hits everywhere. Enemy life bar is a sponge. Slow and too stiff gameplay. Soundtrack is average at best. Graphic wise, they took the easy way. It's faster and easier to hand draw the sprites than create pixelated sprites. Difficulty spike is attrocious.

If I could score it from 0 to 10, this game it's a 6 tops.

The only time I had any fun was seeing they had some ideas similar of mine in the Way of the Warrior mod: The airplane stage, Shiva's creating shadow copies of himself, the castle stage with the stained glass, etc...

I genuinely felt the will to throw my controller on my TV. Of course, I managed to refrain my anger. Never felt so helpless in the other games on Mania like in this one (I finished on Normal difficulty and played 3 stages on Hard with SoR 1 Axel). In the 3 original games, you feel you failed because you made mistakes. In SoR 4, you feel you failed because the game doesn't have a good and efficient enough gameplay to deal with the annoying cheap mobs and bosses of the game.

Luckily, I only spent 1 dolar (100 yen) of the first month of Gamepass to play it. Should I have paid 20, 30 bucks on this one, I would feel tricked by the developer and Sega.

Best thing I did, was to turn the Xbox One X off, turned my Mega Drive on, and started to play SoR 1. Much, much better game and experience.

Jericho_mpm Sat May 02, 2020 7:48 pm

thenomad wrote:Finished the game. It's definitely not good. Never the enemies were so annoying in SoR games like in this one. Cheap hits everywhere. Enemy life bar is a sponge. Slow and too stiff gameplay. Soundtrack is average at best. Graphic wise, they took the easy way. It's faster and easier to hand draw the sprites than create pixelated sprites. Difficulty spike is attrocious.

If I could score it from 0 to 10, this game it's a 6 tops.

This is what i'm telling someone SOR is not designed too be frustrating but this is..

RuffNTumble Sat May 02, 2020 8:37 pm

thenomad wrote:

I genuinely felt the will to throw my controller on my TV.

Second that. The amount of times I've had to roll my eyes, or swear because of some bulls*** cheapness.
Easy mode is avilable, which is a cakewalk for the most part and therefore not as fun, but even that manages to be super irratating.

It seems the devs really didn't like SoR3 either and have mostly ignored it.

I do like the dynamic music though. I think in stage 3 or 4, there's a little drumbeat pootsing away, just carrying your steps, then you drop down the hole and a Yuzo SoR2 mix cuts in, and that's pretty sweet.

thenomad Sun May 03, 2020 2:20 am

RuffNTumble wrote:
I do like the dynamic music though. I think in stage 3 or 4, there's a little drumbeat pootsing away, just carrying your steps, then you drop down the hole and a Yuzo SoR2 mix cuts in, and that's pretty sweet.

I liked two, three songs maybe, along the whole game. But I felt they are disconnected from the style of the first 2 games, and most of it, are simply not memorable, with some parts being repeated too much before moving to the next section of the song...

RuffNTumble wrote:
It seems the devs really didn't like SoR3 either and have mostly ignored it.

I feel like the Lizardcube guys were not really sooo much fan of the series. It feels like they don't get it what made the original games soooo good. The sprite thing bugs me. Theres lots of indie games with much more environments, characters, with the pixel art style, Lizardcube simple did the easist way. I just finished the game Blasphemous last month, that game is gorgeous visually, and it's an indie game. No excuses for the choosen art style for SoR 4.

My conclusion is that they didn't understood the importance of SoR 3 gameplay, despite how the part 3 is bad in comparison to the first 2 games. With the agility of SoR 3 gameplay, SoR 4 difficult could be much more bearable. Most of the cheap moves of the enemies, are cheap because we don't have the gameplay necessary to avoid it.

I had the tendency to play with Floid. Not because I like the character, it's just that he is strong, so the enemies doesn't feel like a sponge so much. With Cherry is a nightmare. She is not really that agile, she has a dash move and that's it, generally doesn't help so much, and her moves take almost no energy of enemies, so I found even more difficult to play with her than Floyd. Stages that I had a game over with her, I finished with Floyd, even with the headache this game presented to me.

oracle Sun May 03, 2020 1:42 pm

Security wrote:Wouldn't buy even if they paid me to

Don't be so harsh! I decided to buy it as a way to show support, even knowing the game could disappoint me.

Security Sun May 03, 2020 4:18 pm

oracle wrote:
Security wrote:Wouldn't buy even if they paid me to

Don't be so harsh! I decided to buy it as a way to show support, even knowing the game could disappoint me.

I am inclined to give it a chance... But for me here who squeezed the hell out of the wonderful fangame, that is almost impossible, i fear. And besides, they shafted GOG buyers, because even though Galaxy (a client) is a thing, they didn't deliver the 2 people online multiplayer mode and price is exactly the same as Steam's.

BUT... One of the developers admitted in steam forums, that they already consider extra content and possibly, future DLC. I will keep an open eye and subsequently, an open mind, as well. But i honestly cannot lay off the EXQUISITE Remake.

Jericho_mpm Sun May 03, 2020 5:14 pm

Security wrote:
oracle wrote:
Security wrote:Wouldn't buy even if they paid me to

Don't be so harsh! I decided to buy it as a way to show support, even knowing the game could disappoint me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3px_uoFct4

Take a look at this bare in mind the time & if new people who are meant too be there target and casuals can pull this off...

Security Sun May 03, 2020 10:39 pm

Ultimately, i bought it. But it's indeed terrible, at least in my books.

- As others already stated, it's like a flash game (graphics). And too cartoonish.
- NO RUNNING. That is !@#$. Many places are overcrowded, lots of corridors are too narrow to go up/down, enemies come from both sides, etc.
- No options for other weapon style. I wanted to grab my metal bat and keep swinging. Just like in the remake. If they didn't hit me a few times, i would beat the stage with it. No chance. No weapon super moves, either. Real bummer.
- Soundtrack okay, nothing special.
- Not all old players are unlockable; no Ash, no Roo and certainly no Electra, Mr.X!
- No police call. Star moves are certainly not that effective and aren't anything like star moves from Remake.
- Special moves drain life, you then have to hit enemies to replenish it. Stupid system. Good old gauge was the thing.
- No branching paths and different stages/directions. No choices during the story (couldn't accept Mr.Y offer, much unlike Sor1 "you became the boss" thing).
- No motorcycle/boat level.
- No GUNS!?
- No gore. No blood and corpse explosions, even if an enemy dies right next to an exploding barrel. Makes you miss the Remake so much!

Combat is average and not very satisfying, either. Seems a bit off, too. Others complain about hitboxes, enemy/player speed, other stuff... I don't know, maybe something like sluggish and not very well responsive controls? I certainly pawn in Remake, in Mania too, in which everything is fast and tricky, but here, the thing gets out of hands quick. Feels slow to play, as well and progressing through a level, is like a big ordeal.

And they sell that for ~25 bucks. Where and when Remake is free. I 'll tell you what. I would gladly pay 50 bucks to Bombergames, rather than this. Even Fight N Rage seems way more polished, especially gameplay wise. How could anyone like it, is so beyond me. I won't refund, but right next to Daikatana, those two are the best WORST games i have ever purchased. Own it in GOG (which by the way, as i already said, doesn't even include Steam's online 2 player coop). Lizardcube did a great job with Wonder Boy, but this is the worst.

**iceweb38** Sun May 03, 2020 10:40 pm

I'm waiting to finish playing with all 5 characters before writing a proper reviews but so far, it's a 8 out of 10 for me. Smile

Jericho_mpm Sun May 03, 2020 11:53 pm

Security wrote:Ultimately, i bought it. But it's indeed terrible, at least in my books.

- As others already stated, it's like a flash game (graphics). And too cartoonish.
- NO RUNNING. That is !@#$. Many places are overcrowded, lots of corridors are too narrow to go up/down,

You can run with the sor3 characters the thing i don't like is they don't blend into the game graphic style it's just rubbish for todays time + they were clearly given a lot of buffs too there damage on top of run and roll but lost there 40,000 * plus extra move, they could of easily redrawn sor 1 2 & 3 characters

Sor 2 characters seem like dirt weak and Max specially was given the stripped treament after all he was so good in 2 i guess they thought lets strip him too death since now Floyd is about

Sor 1 characters Seem fair they have long range jabs that can keep people far apart at times but there specials should of done more damage cos they are limited in that department.

Ash & Roo could of been easily added, Max 4 could of been good in the roster. Even Elle, Shiva 2 or 4, Zamza, MR x,

If any dlc comes out ot updates come out 1st thing they need too do.

Tone down the characters with armor
reduce damage output on some characters
Update the game with run and roll for SOR1 2 and 4 characters.

and the online mode for arcade 2 player which is bad news. if you play and someone online joins and dies they can leave at anytime and if they do they stop your game for good that's messed up...

Security Mon May 04, 2020 1:05 am

Jericho_mpm wrote:
You can run with the sor3 characters the thing i don't like is they don't blend into the game graphic style it's just rubbish for todays time + they were clearly given a lot of buffs too there damage on top of run and roll but lost there 40,000 * plus extra move, they could of easily redrawn sor 1 2 & 3 characters

Sor 2 characters seem like dirt weak and Max specially was given the stripped treament after all he was so good in 2 i guess they thought lets strip him too death since now Floyd is about

Sor 1 characters Seem fair they have long range jabs that can keep people far apart at times but there specials should of done more damage cos they are limited in that department.

Ash & Roo could of been easily added, Max 4 could of been good in the roster. Even Elle, Shiva 2 or 4, Zamza, MR x,

If any dlc comes out ot updates come out 1st thing they need too do.

Tone down the characters with armor
reduce damage output on some characters
Update the game with run and roll for SOR1 2 and 4 characters.

and the online mode for arcade 2 player which is bad news. if you play and someone online joins and dies they can leave at anytime and if they do they stop your game for good that's messed up...

Whatever they do, the content not only is little, but rather, minimal. Game seems to be as long as a single mod of the Remake. Where are the multiple routes and the many scenarios?

I also wonder how many years they devoted, to making Sor4. ~10 from Bomber on the Remake, if memory serves. That clearly shows in both quantity and quality. And since you mentioned it, it just so happens that Shiva Sor2 is my favorite, which is not the one being in 4.

Their later upcoming content, if we are to believe the developer promising things over at steam forum, have much more to implement other than one or two playable characters, in order to appeal to somebody coming from the Remake's way.

thenomad Mon May 04, 2020 5:58 am

Ok, I gave another go, trying to indetify why I feel so angry playing it. I'm on vacation, here in Japan is spring, the sky is clean, I woke up feeling very well, in a very good mood, drank a cup of coffee, and started to play. in 5 minutes my stomach was burning with angry, my morning was ruined and I didn't know why I was having this feeling of impotence.

Observing the enemies behavior, my character behavior, I think I understood what happens. The enemies are too fast for our characters. They not only are too fast, they are not ashamed to surround you, which means being hit from behind every 10 seconds is the norm here. Hell, even trying to reach an enemy that avoids you walking backwards it's a patience test, since they are too fast for you. And while you are walking towards the avoiding enemy, there's another 2 following you from behind. So you can't reach the enemy you're following, but rapidly there's another coming for you, and hitting you before you have any time to press any button to react.

The walk backwards thing is even more annoying against the bosses. You take 5 seconds to finally reach the hitting area of the boss, and if while approaching it, you lined yourself with the boss for a split second too soon, bye bye, the boss takes the lead and hit you with any sort of combo they have. Time to walk to him again while he avoids you, or walk too fast towards you. It's EXTREMELY frustrating.

Plus, the cheap moves. Many of the enemies has long range moves. So you trying desperately manage the 3 enemies surrounding you, and the long range enemy, that is totally out of your reach, simply attacks from distance and hits you. The ones that do this are many: The girl with the aerial kick, the guy with hand in pockets and white hair, the fat guy with fire breath, the Donovans with long weapons, the girls that throw molotovs, the fat chicks that headbutt you from the distance of half screen, etc... There's no shortage of cheap moves from enemies in this game. All builds up to a generally feel of injustice against you. It's not your lack of skill, it's simple unavoidable.

And the dojo part... my god. When I released the first version of Way of the Warrior, I had placed in many parts, lots of knife Galsias together. In my mind, it gave a sort of different challenge for the player. I think it was Don Vecta, call me the attention that those parts are simply annoying. I corrected in the v2 of Way of the Warrior. It seems Lizardcube need to be called too. The first room of the Dojo part is simply stupid, and the worst, cheap part in the entire game (and to be the worst cheap IN THIS GAME, it has to be really that bad).

And I'm not even talking about artistic part of the game (graphics and music). Because if you put everything together in the package, you have a real, real stink bag of poo here.

In my mind, this is not SoR, it's not cannon, It was not developed for people that worked in the original games, it didn't follow the formula, it feels more like a bad mod made for unskilled bunch of not so much fans of the game.

I said before I would gave a 6 out 10. I changed my mind. It's barely a 2 out of 10. Basically no redeeming aspects to this game.

Again, thank god the gamepass service. Didn't spent any big money on this piece of garbage.

Security Mon May 04, 2020 6:42 am

thenomad wrote:Ok, I gave another go, trying to indetify why I feel so angry playing it. I'm on vacation, here in Japan is spring, the sky is clean, I woke up feeling very well, in a very good mood, drank a cup of coffee, and started to play. in 5 minutes my stomach was burning with angry, my morning was ruined and I didn't know why I was having this feeling of impotence.

Observing the enemies behavior, my character behavior, I think I understood what happens. The enemies are too fast for our characters. They not only are too fast, they are not ashamed to surround you, which means being hit from behind every 10 seconds is the norm here. Hell, even trying to reach an enemy that avoids you walking backwards it's a patience test, since they are too fast for you. And while you are walking towards the avoiding enemy, there's another 2 following you from behind. So you can't reach the enemy you're following, but rapidly there's another coming for you, and hitting you before you have any time to press any button to react.

The walk backwards thing is even more annoying against the bosses. You take 5 seconds to finally reach the hitting area of the boss, and if while approaching it, you lined yourself with the boss for a split second too soon, bye bye, the boss takes the lead and hit you with any sort of combo they have. Time to walk to him again while he avoids you, or walk too fast towards you. It's EXTREMELY frustrating.

Plus, the cheap moves. Many of the enemies has long range moves. So you trying desperately manage the 3 enemies surrounding you, and the long range enemy, that is totally out of your reach, simply attacks from distance and hits you. The ones that do this are many: The girl with the aerial kick, the guy with hand in pockets and white hair, the fat guy with fire breath, the Donovans with long weapons, the girls that throw molotovs, the fat chicks that headbutt you from the distance of half screen, etc... There's no shortage of cheap moves from enemies in this game. All builds up to a generally feel of injustice against you. It's not your lack of skill, it's simple unavoidable.

And the dojo part... my god. When I released the first version of Way of the Warrior, I had placed in many parts, lots of knife Galsias together. In my mind, it gave a sort of different challenge for the player. I think it was Don Vecta, call me the attention that those parts are simply annoying. I corrected in the v2 of Way of the Warrior. It seems Lizardcube need to be called too. The first room of the Dojo part is simply stupid, and the worst, cheap part in the entire game (and to be the worst cheap IN THIS GAME, it has to be really that bad).

And I'm not even talking about artistic part of the game (graphics and music). Because if you put everything together in the package, you have a real, real stink bag of poo here.

In my mind, this is not SoR, it's not cannon, It was not developed for people that worked in the original games, it didn't follow the formula, it feels more like a bad mod made for unskilled bunch of not so much fans of the game.

I said before I would gave a 6 out 10. I changed my mind. It's barely a 2 out of 10. Basically no redeeming aspects to this game.

Again, thank god the gamepass service. Didn't spent any big money on this piece of garbage.

Yes. And even if you play smart (going up or down while pressing left or right simultaneously from an enemy to get well out of his range then proceed to retaliate, doing zig zags while walking forward to maneuver so as to approach him crab-running fashion in order to not get hit, changing momentarily directions in the middle of the combo to hit the backwards "row" of guys suddenly ganging up on you then returning to original facing direction and continue hitting or whatever else you might come up with)... The player still takes too much damage, "like a sponge"! As players at steam forums say. Even Floyd! Where and when Max used to take much more beating, before losing a life, other than the high damage itself. Also, unlike max, he hasn't got the sweep, which momentarily incapacitated everybody making contact, leaving them open for grabs.

Did i just now say, "grabs"? Grab and throw is, grab and pummeling your victim while the latter is helplessly sitting in your armslock, isn't a thing!

Lots of things are absent. Gameplay mechanisms and options are too little, too few.

thenomad Mon May 04, 2020 8:03 am

Well. I'm in a moment in my life, that I can't simply waste my (rare) leisure time getting angry and frustrated. So I simply did the best thing I can do: uninstaled this piece of shit from my Xbox and I don't intend to touch it ever again. I'll go back to GTA V, Super Lucky Tale and Magic The Gathering Arena, the three games that I was playing before deciding to waste my time, mental health and patience with this turd. I mean, Magic and GTA has it's bad moments of frustration too, but nothing compared to this masochist, infuriating and excuse of a indie game that Lizardcube managed to produce. I'm done with it.

One comparison that can be made, why SoR 4 sucks, is with God Of War (the old ones, no the "Ryse" esque version of PS4). In GoW, You feel empowered. The blades of chaos are amazing, and you feel you can obliterate anything the game throw at you. And still, the game on hardest difficulties is extremely hardcore. In the other hand, in SoR 4, you feel undepowered. Dragged down. Overwhelmed. Your character is too slow. your moves takes almost no health of enemies. You don't have approriated movements to respond certain enemy moves. it's like playing with something holding you back.

I simply can't believe how much praise this game is getting on the media. Well, if you think about it, game journalists always play on Easy difficult, doesn't give a shit about respecting the past games, copy other ones reviews, etc... it's the only way to like this game, in my oppinion...

oracle Mon May 04, 2020 10:23 am

Someone managed to hack the game and play with SOR4 Max and bosses https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BH8Y6lHG56Q

Jericho_mpm Mon May 04, 2020 12:31 pm

Some mad stuff there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLSS_sXDUsA

Security Mon May 04, 2020 1:16 pm

Jericho_mpm wrote:Some mad stuff there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLSS_sXDUsA

Now you 're talking! Those floor sliding -> underneath enemies "hit them while you move", moves... Are what was really missing!

Jericho_mpm Mon May 04, 2020 1:18 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qDyIuAKypc

oracle Mon May 04, 2020 1:24 pm

Jericho_mpm wrote:Some mad stuff there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLSS_sXDUsA

He is using the Shiva SOR2 sprites from the secret retro level. Really nice!

Security Mon May 04, 2020 1:37 pm

oracle wrote:
Jericho_mpm wrote:Some mad stuff there https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLSS_sXDUsA

He is using the Shiva SOR2 sprites from the secret retro level. Really nice!

If somebody would do the same with Mr.X, that would be a deal maker, at least for me!

Iceferno Mon May 04, 2020 1:44 pm

I like to start out on Easy with these games, to get a feel for it, and to see the entire progression in the main mode. But even on the lowest difficulty, I find it very hard. The enemies have the aggression of a Final Fight game, and bosses such as Barbon and Shiva dart about the playing field so rapidly, the fact that the main characters of 4 don't have dodge abilities for the most part doesn't make sense.

You can unlock retro characters later on, but even they've been nerfed a little. SOR3 running feels incredibly slow, as do the rolls. When SOR3 Skate does his on-shoulder punching (I forget the actual name), enemies on Skate's side can still break you out of it. There are a lot more vulnerable windows with your characters vs AI. I've found myself trying to get a good combo chain going, finishing one move and starting another, but some moves don't start soon enough for you not to be broken out of the combo. The combat fluidity of SOR3 and V5 just isn't there. In a game that rewards high combos, I find that puzzling. You're encouraged to build up combos, yet you have to evade enemies to dodge combo breaks. So since I suck, I should probably forget the whole combo thing and choose to essentially play to survive.

I do like how you can improve ranks in Stage Select and even finishing stages in select still adds to your lifetime score. But aside from muting the music to work on my alternative OST, this game has very little to offer me. It mostly just makes me feel bad because I'm not good enough.

Security Mon May 04, 2020 4:13 pm

Iceferno wrote:I like to start out on Easy with these games, to get a feel for it, and to see the entire progression in the main mode. But even on the lowest difficulty, I find it very hard. The enemies have the aggression of a Final Fight game, and bosses such as Barbon and Shiva dart about the playing field so rapidly, the fact that the main characters of 4 don't have dodge abilities for the most part doesn't make sense.

You can unlock retro characters later on, but even they've been nerfed a little. SOR3 running feels incredibly slow, as do the rolls. When SOR3 Skate does his on-shoulder punching (I forget the actual name), enemies on Skate's side can still break you out of it. There are a lot more vulnerable windows with your characters vs AI. I've found myself trying to get a good combo chain going, finishing one move and starting another, but some moves don't start soon enough for you not to be broken out of the combo. The combat fluidity of SOR3 and V5 just isn't there. In a game that rewards high combos, I find that puzzling. You're encouraged to build up combos, yet you have to evade enemies to dodge combo breaks. So since I suck, I should probably forget the whole combo thing and choose to essentially play to survive.

I do like how you can improve ranks in Stage Select and even finishing stages in select still adds to your lifetime score. But aside from muting the music to work on my alternative OST, this game has very little to offer me. It mostly just makes me feel bad because I'm not good enough.

Wait until you reach the elevator or fight against Max... This thing is great to make people angry and ragequit, especially with lacking gameplay options and whatnot.

Small tips to save the day... In order to dodge, move mostly northwestern or southeastern to avoid hits, meaning not only up and down, but at the same time, as faraway as possible from enemies. Like in 1, jump attacks can sometimes substitute for running and hitting, since they work fast and cover distance decently. Most enemies attacks are telegraphed, so immediately move away, the instant their hands/legs start to move towards a different angle. Like in SorR, don't chase them and take initiative in attacking, but mostly learn their patterns, dodge and counterattack. Enemies with high defense MUST be grabbed, or else they are invincible and destroy you.

Ugly, choppy game, sluggish combat and even worse? Stupid story. Brainwashing music and balderdash. Bare Knuckle 3 with mass destruction, general abducted etc was all the heat. I am at the concert, near the end and thing is boring as... Well. Other than frustrating. Right after you unlock him, the nigga bro must be your playa, especially if you need to clear Chinatown.

Game is terrible. Unless they add content and variety, it doesn't hold a single candle to either SOR in general, or the Remake right here.

**Saven** Mon May 04, 2020 5:14 pm

I finished it on Saturday. I'm leaning towards a 7 or 8 for my first initial impressions.

Quick notes:
- I will give credit to mostly getting the feel of SOR(2) down. I was playing SOR2 prior to it, and it felt like I was just picking it right back up. This, to me, was the most important part of a SOR game and I'm glad this was the area they focused on the most.
- I'm 50/50 on how bosses operate. I don't mind the challenge, but I don't know if it's necessarily right for SOR.
- The music started off great, but by the time you get to stage 3, I just forgot it even existed.
- Rolling and running is needed in this game, pronto. Some of these bosses are ridiculous for some characters like Axel late game.
- Some elements just felt completely out of place for a SOR game like the final boss itself.
- I probably would've liked the game better had it not been for it's artstyle. Sorry, it just never clicked with me.
- The story was really stupid. Please don't ever do that in another SOR game again.

To add on to that comment about the story and the main antagonist of the game:

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